Native ChocTalk

S2, E7, P1: Jim Gray, Former Chief of the 𐓁𐓣 𐓂𐓤𐓘𐓯𐓤𐓘͘ (Osage) Nation, on His Family & The Reign of Terror

“Despite our wealth, our lives were cheap. 
- Jim Gray discussing his Osage people in “Indian Country Today” magazine, Sept 13, 2019

On February 6th, 1923, hunters came upon a Buick that had crashed into a slope in Fairfax, Oklahoma. The 40-year-old driver was found slumped over the steering wheel, a bullet in the back of his head. He was an Osage man, lured into a dangerous trap by a white man - someone he thought was a good and trusted friend. 

The book, “Killers of the Flower Moon” by David Grann tells the story of the Osage murders and “The Reign of Terror”, a time when non-Native guardians were killing for the sake of inheriting land. But not just any land – Oklahoma mineral rich land, and the oil was producing millions of dollars for the tribe. This story is soon to be released as a movie by Martin Scorsese, with Robert De Niro, Leonardo DiCaprio and an impressive slew of Native actors from across Oklahoma and elsewhere.

Join me in this conversation with Jim Gray, the great grandson of the man found murdered in the car - Henry Roan. Although it happened long ago, the pain couldn’t be more real, and it’s still felt today among his family members and the community.

As former Chief of the Osage Nation, Jim was actually the youngest Chief in modern history and you’ll hear about how in 2004, he was able to ensure the Osage’s sovereignty was finally recognized!

You’ll also learn about:

⦁ The impact Jim had on Martin Scorsese to rewrite the “Killers of the Flower Moon” script
⦁ How his friend taught Robert De Niro to speak Osage 
⦁ Thoughts on Osage living side-by-side with descendants of those who killed the Osage
⦁ The story of David Grann at a book signing. Hint: the descendants of both William Hale and Henry Roan were present
⦁ Whizbang, OK and why Jim’s face turned red
⦁ The latest on McGirt vs Oklahoma and tribal sovereignty, and Governor Stitt’s fight to have the Supreme Court ruling reversed

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S2, E6: His School Counselor Labelled Him, ‘Not college material’. Dr. Wayne Johnson, Muscogee

He happened to look down at what his counselor had jotted down on a piece of paper in his school file. He couldn’t help but take a peek. What did it say? The 3 words could’ve set his destiny in stone forever. “Not college material.” The phrase sank into his mind, solidifying what his future may entail – anything but college, he concluded, based on his counselor’s findings. After all, a counselor would know, right?

So how did this “not college material” Muscogee man end up achieving his master’s degree, followed by his Doctorate in Educational Leadership and Policy Analysis, working for the Muscogee Nation as Secretary of Education, getting published in articles on Indian education, becoming Tribal Assembly President, and Educational Counselor appointed by the Governor and working on the executive board for the Johnson O’Malley Program? Oh, and not to mention, also serving our country in the Navy too!

My guest in today’s episode is Dr. Wayne Johnson, and despite his hard work and success, he and I humbly said to me, “None of that compares to when I was a teacher.” God bless you, Wayne!

In this episode, you’ll hear about:

• The precious words of Wayne’s mother detailing how she was taken from her family and sent to Chilocco Indian School
• How Wayne and his siblings were taken to a children’s home
• His powerful experience at Haskell Indian College
• How his parents believed in and influenced their sons’ futures
• His work at Riverside Indian School, Haskell Indian School, Pine Ridge Reservation, Flandreau Indian School and Rosebud Reservation
• Pine Ridge Reservation and the events that occurred there, such as Wounded Knee Massacre and more
• His friendship with Oglala Lakota, Tamakoce Te’Hila, (known as Billy Mills), 1964 Olympic gold medal champion, and how no one was expecting an American Indian to show up and win

I hope you’ll take inspiration from Wayne’s story (and Billy Mills’ too) and feel empowered to do what you’re meant to do in life, despite what someone may have said to or thought of you. The world is your oyster, my friends so release those chains of others’ opinions and go seize the day!

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S2, E5, P2: Stickball, Little Brother of War: Mississippi Choctaws, Mark Williams & Chalena Marcus Billy

“If you wanna see women go to war, I would say come to Choctaw, Mississippi!”

– Chalena Marcus Billy from the Pearl River Ohoyo Team 2021 Stickball Champions

Welcome to a new episode of Native ChocTalk’s Part 2 of “Stickball, Little Brother of War: Mississippi Choctaws, Mark Williams & Chalena Marcus Billy.

Listen to the episode here! https://tinyurl.com/ybbkdhvy

In part 1, stickball player, expert and stickmaker, Brenner Billy taught us about the history, culture and spirituality around the historic American Indian game of stickball.

Part 2 is here, y’all! And I know you’ll enjoy hearing from both Mark Williams, award-winning Choctaw filmmaker and champion stickball player, Chalena Marcus Billy.

Mark looks back at how he raised money to make films by having an Indian taco sale, how he practiced horror filmmaking on his friends (and they survived), all about his comics titled, “The adventures of Josie the Frybread Kid” and about his success today earning awards for his incredible films.

And last but not least, this ohoyo powerhouse, Chalena tells us what it’s like to play in this historic and dangerous game, about the difference between stickball in Oklahoma vs. Mississippi and how as a woman, her desire to play stickball derives from a drive deep within that differs from that of her male counterparts. But even this seemingly indestructable champion had a tender perspective on how the loss of the most important person in her life affected her world, yet made her the person and stickball player she is today.

You don’t want to miss this!

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S2, E5, P1: Stickball, Little Brother Of War, Brenner Billy, Choctaw

When you think of certain sports like football, you think rough, tough and full of injuries. But that’s nothing compared to say, rugby. Now THAT’s a dangerous sport. But have you heard of a sport that involved a goal to settle disputes between tribes, and sometimes so fierce that it ended in death?

The players of this game prepared by painting their bodies and limiting their diet, drinking Spanish Tea made of bark from red oak trees. And by not eating and sleeping for days and nights, they’d be filled with rage by the time the game kicked off.

As many as 1,000 men from opposing tribes screamed their war cries to the incessant beating of drums. 

With no protective gear, no referees and very few rules, the game began. The preciseness of thrusting a minuscule ball onto a narrow pole can only be performed by generations of warriors inheriting and honing their skill and focus - that same focus of those who hunted the stealthy deer and the running chukfi (rabbit). The game lasted for days, from sun-up to sundown. Whoever won, won not just the dispute, but also their tribe and oppositions’ respect. 

Today in part 1 of “Stickball, Little Brother of War” we discuss the spiritual and hard-core game of stickball, where even as recent as 1937, an eyewitness named Frank Grall was interviewed from Wewoka, Oklahoma while watching a stickball game saying, “…but when the first fellow got the ball, some player hit him over the head with a club, peeling the skin until it hung over his ear. The battle was so fierce, that when the game was ended and one side had been chased from the ground, the pool was perfectly bloody.” (The pool he’s talking about is where the women would pull the men from the game and place them in pools of water to try to get them to regain consciousness.)  He then said, “This was the last Indian ball game played in such a brutal manner, for the Government took notice of such brutality and sent deputy marshals to the games to prevent such cruelty. At this game I saw players bite one another.”

Yep. Definitely rough.

As we talk about this historic and spiritual game that’s still played today, who better to talk about it than expert, Brenner Billy (Choctaw). He comes from a long line of stickball players, he’s damn good at the game, and even he’s a master at making the sticks – a skill passed down to him by family.

And stay tuned for part 2 of “Stickball, Little Brother of War” where I’ll meet with both a filmmaker who documents the world of stickball, as well as one very strong Chahta oyoho (Choctaw lady) and total stickball rock star.

Yakoke!

 

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S2, E4 - 150 Years at Riverside Indian School: Timothy Yeahquo, Kiowa”

You’ve heard the heartbreaking stories of the American Indian boarding schools from years past. And the accounts continue to unfold – children of all ages being removed from their homes, a government intent on “killing the man, saving the Indian”, and innocent kids being taught to forsake their language, customs, traditions and all they’ve ever known. 

But what about the boarding schools that were turned over to the Bureau of Indian Affairs? There’s one such school today that’s run by American Indians, whose mission is not only to teach, but also to encourage and help students to understand, learn about and preserve their history, language ad culture.  

Today, we celebrate the 150th anniversary of Riverside Indian School – the oldest off-reservation Native American boarding school in the United States today! And this, my friends is a boarding school that’s a far cry from those of the past. 

Growing up in Anadarko, Oklahoma and my father working at Riverside, as well as knowing many alumni and teachers, allowed me the experience that others may not know or understand. Take a listen to hear why.

And there truly is so much more to this story. In today’s episode, you’ll hear from Timothy Yeahquo (Kiowa) about:

• The history of Riverside and the Quakers who originally started it
• How the Navajo contributed to keeping Riverside from closing down
• Riverside’s former names
• 76 tribes from all over the US have attended to Riverside. One can walk through the campus at times, enjoying the sound of drums echoing through the campus or watching a game of stickball being played. 

For Riverside Indian School’s 150 year celebration in 2022, alumni, students and teachers will enjoy (at no cost) listening to a Riverside alumni comedian, a concert, a powwow, an art show, a fashion show and more!

For contributions (utilized for student events, shoes for sports, prom dresses, hygiene products and more), please contact: Timothy Yeahquo, timothy.yeahquo@bie.edu, Riverside Indian School, 101 Riverside Drive Anadarko, OK 73005 

Listeners, please stay tuned for a future episode dedicated to the children and tragic stories of the boarding schools, with a guest who will share about the historical trauma carried on today from her own experience, as well as that of her ancestors and thousands of others. We pray for hope and healing for all who have been affected and may we never forget the innocent children who lost so much. And we wish Riverside students many blessings on their journey of education, cultural preservation and future opportunities! 

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S2, E3: Sarah Elisabeth & Lynda Kay Sawyer, Ancestral History & Anniversary Of Tushpa’s Story

There’s an incredibly powerful book that changed the way we understand and “feel” the journeys of those who walked the Trail of Tears. It’s called Tushpa's Story (Touch My Tears: Tales from the Trail of Tears Collection), and January 28, 2022, is the 6th anniversary of its release!

What better way to celebrate this anniversary than by hearing more about the book, directly from Choctaw Author, Sarah Elisabeth Sawyer. And guess what? You can either buy the book on this website (https://www.sarahelisabethwrites.com/), or you can download a FREE copy (by clicking on the red ribbon at the top and signing up for the newsletter)!

Sarah isn’t just a writer - she’s a trailblazer. In her collections, she takes our historical Choctaw stories and events and creates fascinating can’t-put-it-down historical fiction books (“heavy on the fiction and heavy on the on the history”, she says) – finally, a way to make our history come alive!

A special guest, Sarah Elisabeth’s mother, Lynda Kay was also willing to join in to share about the work she does to support Sarah’s writing, about their family’s ancestral stories and about her photography, writing and jewelry design. Check out this website to see her jewelry! https://www.sarahelisabethwrites.com/shopping?category=Jewelry

Sarah Elisabeth mentions in her website, “enduring hope and incredible beauty rises from the ashes.” And that’s what I love about these books. Each one conveys hope, even in the worst of times. I think you’ll be inspired, so enjoy and let me know what you think!

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S2, E2, Chief Mushulatubbee & The Traditional vs Progressive Struggle, Steven Hunter Oklatubee

Buckle up, y’all. Because today you’re going to study with me and my guest about a time in history when the entire future of our Indigeneous people had come to a crossroads that depended upon crucial decisions. Would each tribe fight for the right to stay in the land of their ancestors? Or would they succumb to the pressures of colonization and the removal to the new, unknown lands of Indian Territory.

These decisions, which could mean life or death for many or all, were the burden of every Chief.

No one personifies this pivotal moment more than the man some described as, the “Last great chief of the Choctaw.” His name was Mushulatubbee. And my guest, Steven Hunter, is the fifth great grandson of this great “Minco” (or Chief, in Choctaw). Steven presents his extensive research and his paper about this Minco, who was tasked with balancing the elements of an ever-changing world that would change the tribe’s way of life forever.

And perhaps a new appreciation will be born for the hundreds of Mincos who suffered under the tremendous burden of choice during these times. May they never be forgotten…

 

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S2, E1, P2: Rachael Youngman, Part 2, The Choctaw Girl from Hog Creek

WELCOME to Season 2 of Native Choctalk, A Podcast by Natives For All!

My Producer and friend, Bee will be interviewing me in this 2nd of a 2 part series. I am honored to openly share about my ancestral stories, following the lineage of my great grandmother Ella, starting with her mother, Rosa Coley. I say “openly share”, because for too long, our ancestors were told to “be quiet”, to not speak their language and to disown their culture and traditions. I hope to be their voice today, to keep their memories alive and to honor their story and their journey.

You’ll hear about the journey of the Coley family, who were outstanding and prominent citizens in their Choctaw community. Yet, in the year 1896, with the fate of one single decision, their lives would change forever, and generations to come would stare poverty, loss, abuse and death in the face.

Yet even in the midst of such sorrow, resiliency, faith and sheer Okie red dirt grit, held this tight-knit family together. 1896 may have knocked some down, but they were not out, and they found strength in family and in rebuilding together.

Bee and I enjoyed recording these 2 episodes - we can’t seem to get together without laughing and carrying on. However, although we may occasionally burst into friendship mode and a laugh or two, we do care deeply about the people we’re discussing, and we take the issues at hand very seriously.

Yakoke to my ancestors for choosing to carry on, despite the pain and sorrow, and for living the example of strength and resiliency by which we, your descendants can forever be inspired.

CHAHTA SIA HOKE!

 

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S2, E1, P1 - Rachael Youngman: The Choctaw Girl From Hog Creek

WELCOME to Season 2 of Native Choctalk, A Podcast by Natives For All!

I’d like to thank each and every one of you who listened in Season 1 and supported this effort to preserve our American Indian stories, history, culture and traditions!

And, in order to take my own advice about preserving stories, today’s episode is in 2 parts and it’s a bit of my own story as well as that of my own ancestors.

My Producer and friend, Bee will be interviewing me today. We may have had a little too much fun recording these episodes - we can’t seem to get together without laughing and carrying on. However, although we may occasionally burst into friendship mode and a laugh or two, we do care deeply about the people we’re discussing, and we take the issues at hand very seriously.

In this first of 2 parts in this series, I share about growing up as 1 of 3 “feral” children in the country way out yonder in Hog Creek, miles outside of Anadarko, Oklahoma.

And I’ll share the raw truth about the challenges that came later as I navigated life as a divorced, single mom. And about the inspiration I found in my favorite Bible verse and how it prompted this Okie girl to pull herself up by her bootstraps.

Yakoke (thanks) to Chihowa (God) and to my chukka achvffa (family) for loving and supporting me.

Chahta sia hoke!

 

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S1, E17: Steve & Seba Discuss Their New Book, “The Native American Contest Powwow: Cultural Tethering Theory”

Public Service Announcement: Y’all have to check out the Choctaw Powwow, coming up Dec 4^th and 5th, 2021 in Durant, Oklahoma! You’ll get to experience the Dancer Contest, Drum Contest, Pow Wow Stickball Exhibition games and good fellowship. Feel free to post photos to my Native ChocTalk Facebook page if you get to go!  https://www.choctawnation.com/powwow

 

My guests, Dr. Steven Aicinena and Dr. Seba Ziyanak share details from their new book, “The Native American Contest Powwow: Cultural Tethering Theory” and I think you’ll find it fascinating and informative. You’ll learn about:

 

• Why the powwows are actually crucial (not just social)
• Can contest dancing be considered a sport?
• The “stranger viewpoint” on powwows (observances by non-Natives)
• Comparison of powwows to other cultures globally
• Traditional powwows vs contest powwows
• Are the contests spiritual or just for competition?

 

Let me know what you think and yakoke!

 

Season 1, Episode 17: “Steve & Seba Discuss Their New Book, “The Native American Contest Powwow: Cultural Tethering Theory”

 

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